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Posted 5 Months, 2 Weeks ago
Don't Panic
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As a Charlie lover, I was excited to see Part 1 of Kino's latest restored Chaplin Essanay on TCM last night. However, I have a big question/concern:

It seems to me that the films, in this new version, are just run at too slow a speed. I have always believed, due to the writings of Walter Kerr, and others, that the silent comedies were SUPPOSED to run at a slightly faster-than life pace...say, at about 22-24 frames per second, making a two reeler this last about 20-22 minutes.

But these restored Kino Chaplin two reelers run almost a full 30 minutes - at about (at least according to my calculations) around 16-18 frames per second.

Again, I'm certainly not a professional film restorer/historian, and maybe I'm just reacting to what I've come to be used to in watching Chaplin two reelers for most of my life, but these Kino Chaplins just seem to me to be awfully slow. It just seems to me that the cadences of the film movement, of Chaplin doing twists and turns and falls, are done in an almost real-life time frame (i.e., at the natural speed that they would occur in life) rather than at the slightly faster than life speed I've always thought was intended - not only by Charlie, but by most silent film comedians.

Can anyone comment on this?

Lonnie N.
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Posted 5 Months, 2 Weeks ago
MatiCamsb
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Slowing up the speed is one way these silly companies 'RESTORE' silents.. The other way is to increase the amount of time on the title cards. Most of the so called restored silents by Kino are run at rediculous speeds. They simply increase the title card time and slow the movie time and add copyrighted nonsense (usally irritating new title cards or music which ruins the feeling of the film)

If you want to see silents as they were originally seen stay away from the so called 'restored' garbarge.

posted by Vitaphone

Wow, 'silly companies', 'restored garbage', and 'copyrighted nonsense'! What a wonderful, generous attitude to have toward the only people in the business who aren't looking for a quick buck! Perhaps you don't have to like it, but I think your reply is childish and unhelpful. I suppose you would like the old days of crappy 16mm prints projected at 24fs with musical 'scores' pirated from grannie's Lawrence Welk collection. Fine, I'm sure if you advance your cause with the kind of helpful insight shown in your post, Kino or Image would be GLAD to hire YOU to produce videos of silents. Try Madacy's 'Metropolis', video
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Posted 5 Months, 2 Weeks ago
Brian
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I thought you were dead.
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Posted 5 Months, 2 Weeks ago
BlueMan137
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I'm just a beginner here, but I've learned that the question of the correct film speed is one of the most hotly debated question among silent film fans. I asked a similar question in another newsgroup and it was like poking a stick in a nest of wasps :o)

I am one of those who think that silent comedy such as Chaplin's needs to be projected a little 'too fast' to add some speed to the chases, pratfalls and other visual gags. I believe I've also read that some people who worked in the silent film industry have confirmed that this was the usual way to do it and that this effect was desired by the directors and actors of the time.

Discussions about the proper speed is made even more difficult because there was no universally agreed standard film speed in the days of the hand cranked cameras. The written records about the film speeds used are rare and sometimes contradictionary. It seems as if the proper film speeds are a bigger issue for us than for the people involved at the time: some silent cinema owners told their projectionists to speed up the films so that they could squeeze in one more show during the night.

It also seems to be a pretty well established fact that camera and projector speeds were slowly increasing from around 16-18 fps until they were close to 24 fps at the time when sound arrived.

Best regards, Hakan Lindgren

If you're interested to read more about this, there are some good articles at http://www.cinemaweb.com/silentfilm/bookshelf/

Some quotes from an article by Kevin Brownlow, 'Silent film: What is the correct speed?', Sight & Sound 1980

A 1915 projectionist's handbook declared- in emphatic capitals- 'THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A SET CAMERA SPEED!' The correct speed of projection, it added, is the speed at which each individual scene was taken- 'which may- and often does- vary wildly.' And it declared: 'One of the highest functions of projection is to watch the screen and regulate the speed of projection to synchronise with the speed of taking.' - - - During the Nickelodeon period, films were projected at whatever speed suited the management. The standard was supposed to be 16 fps. 'I remember running a full 1,000 ft. reel in 12 minutes at the eight o'clock show,' recalled Victor Milner, who later became a leading Hollywood cameraman, 'and in the afternoon I used to project the same reel so slow it took Maurice Costello ages to cross the set. Those were my manager's orders.' - - - The Essanay Film Company of Chicago tried to beat wily exhibitors by printing the running time of the films on the posters. The exhibitors retaliated by pasting a strip of paper over the line. Some unscrupulous theatre managers could get through a full reel in six minutes! - - - (Brownlow's notes on his own restoration work) It was particularly fascinating to run the early films, altering the speed until the movement seemed absolutely right. A pattern emerged that seemed related to the year of production, the studio and, of course, the cameraman. Yet these speeds seldom corresponded with the speeds at which the films were shown in the theatres. It is possible to check these because they were specified on the cue sheets. These cue sheets were issued to the musical directors of the theatres, and contained musical suggestions. The same sheets were available for the projectionists. - - - Everyone has a slightly different sense of rhythm; I tended to favour a frame or two faster than David Gill, for instance.
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Posted 5 Months, 1 Week ago
Calibre
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Thanks Termite: that article by Brownlow that you gave the link to was terrific!

Lonnie N.
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